Crazy Thread: Massive Tile Loss

[JasmineFilter]

(Why the subject of Deleted Posts is so important)

Many public boards often find it necessary to delete posts that are offensive, illegal, etc. However, the Kamado Forum has chosen to implement a highly restrictive policy that defies logic since it is self-destructive. Kamado.com just looks plain stupid when they allow posts slamming their product to remain on the board, but then delete any posts that hint of a customer service problem. In addition, Kamado.com has now gained a reputation for draconian censorship, ignoring their customers and just plain stupidity as a result of their forum policy.

How stupid is it? The typical post which merits examination complains of lack of response to emails and phone calls. There have been 3 types of responses:

1) Richard Johnson, owner of Kamado.com, calls the poster a liar.
2) Richard Johnson instructs the person who has emailed and phoned for weeks or even months with no reply to send an email or call them.
3) Most likely, the post will be deleted.

It is important to note that it doesn't matter whether the poster is polite or antagonistic. Even posters who reply to others saying "I have that problem too, I've emailed and called for two weeks, and I'm still haven't heard anything" get deleted. However, the ultimate example of Kamado.com stupidity is a recent thread started by Vickie. She posted this photo:



showing massive tile failure on her cooker. This is not a very good way to promote your product. Would you want the world to know and even view a photo of the poor quality of your product? After all, Kamados have a reputation for tile failure. One Kamado regular even claims it is to be expected and that tile replacement is simple maintenance, like changing the oil in your car. One might think of congratulating Kamado.com for allowing the post. Perhaps they are acknowledging that their product has a serious flaw and perhaps they will be improving quality as a result?

No, this is the first stupid thing about this post. Kamado.com not only is advertising their poor quality, but they are also advertising their attitude that despite the lifetime warrantee they claim to offer, massive tile failure is not covered. Fix it yourself!

Ah, but we digress. The thread containing this picture continues on talking about how this is normal, how it can be fixed, war stories about other cookers worse than hers that have been fixed, etc. To this lady's credit, she is willing to attempt the repair herself and desires replacement tiles from the company. However, after a week or so, she made the mistake of posting that she had emailed and called to see about getting tiles and still had received no reponse:

[Porkchop]

jas, this is great. you have put into words the essence of their approach towards their customers. your observations reveal that the "spin" at kamado.com has reached the point where it is no longer necessary for them to hide the fact that their cookers shed tiles. it is now a EXPECTED TO OCCUR, because it happens so often. the "faithful" there have been trained to smile and just consider it part of the "hobby" of ceramic cooking. they are hypnotized; they have been bamboozled.

it would be different if they were the ONLY ceramic cooker out there, or even the only TILED ceramic cooker out there. they aren't. there are options for those that don't feel like re-tiling their cooker after a few years of use. kamado.com's defense against other companies is slander, as opposed to improving their product and keeping their word. lies are free, standing behind an inferior product... not free.

look for a "tile-it-yourself" model to be made available soon... actually, they've ALWAYS sold that model, right??
_________________
Expand Q Consciousness
http://porkchopbbq.freehostia.com/

[Admin]

Excellent post, Jas.

For the record, here are the deleted posts you cited.


http://www.kamadofraudforum.org/kthreads/massivetileloss.htm

http://www.kamadofraudforum.org/kthreads/massivetileloss2.htm

Many more deleted posts are forthcoming.

[foxhound]

This thread makes me laugh.. I've torn out old tile showers and not come across all the tiles popping off. If this were typical of tile (especially in just a few years) it would not be used in pools and showers. Who would buy a bbq knowing they probably will have to re-tile it in a few years. I wonder if they just run out of additive for the thinset and keep on making the bbq's anyway


Bugs
Member
Post Number: 49
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Friday, July 21, 2006 - 10:50 am[/color]:

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is this defect not covered in the warranty?



Bugs
Member
Post Number: 51
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 6:10 pm:

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this is really a stumbling block to me. i still plan to by a ceramic cooker soon after my wedding and this brand is one of the 2 i will choose from. i asked if this was normal and i cant find where that post went.

i see where some folks were offered replacements, so my question is to the owners, if all the tiles fall off do ya'll replace the grill for me. its going to be next year before i by one but im trying to get things all figured out.




Alanz
Moderator
Post Number: 1055
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 6:27 pm:

All the tiles, eh? I don't know anyone who has had that happen


Bobinfla
Member
Post Number: 1511
Registered: 2-2002
Posted on Sunday, July 23, 2006 - 6:41 pm:

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Quote (from the website)
"LIFETIME GUARANTEE
We guarantee your Kamado will never "burn out," or break such that the unit looses its ability to function. Our formulas will withstand heat that can be obtained with charcoal. You can truly expect a lifetime of enjoyment."

As I read the guarantee, it says nothing about tiles falling off. This to me means that it a maintenance issue. When I've chipped a tile or two (or more), the people @ Kamado were very helpful with information and tips. Most of that information is also included on this forum (using the "search" function).

BOB


Bugs
Member
Post Number: 52
Registered: 6-2006
Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 4:16 am:

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ok, that was the question I wanted answered. seems like a few people were offered a replacement in this thread when their tiles fell off. So tiles and tilework is not warrentied i guess.

just curious are these major tile problems maintenance issues? or these people not doing something right according to the maintenance book for there tiles to be falling off like this. im good with maintennace so if thats all it is im ok.

(Message edited by bugs on July 24, 2006)

(Message edited by bugs on July 24, 2006) [/color][/color]



Alanz
Moderator
Post Number: 1056
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 6:56 am:

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Sounds to me like you'll be just fine


Grillslave
Member
Post Number: 229
Registered: 7-2001
Posted on Monday, July 24, 2006 - 8:38 am:

Bugs,
I think most of the "tile problems" could be traced to maintenance issues (my problems certainly were). The fact of life is that tiles do come loose on almost any surface they are installed on including bathrooms, kitchens, etc. The main cause of tiles coming loose is water getting under the tiles. This happens via water seeping through the grout. The extra issue with the K is that it also goes through heating cycle which means controlling water penetration is even more important. I had a tile kitchen counter once and the tiles near the cook top kept popping off until I woke up and sealed the grout better. The only 100% sure solution is to go textured which has no tiles. It may not look as spectacular but it will be trouble free.

All that said, there is the official guarantee and then there is the people behind the company. What most people have found is that if you deal with the Johnson family in a reasonable, adult fashion they will bend over backwards to help you. A new movie called Brokeback Kamado? I know that they were very helpful to me, provided expert advice when needed and have provided me several replacement parts at no cost.

Kent[size=12]

[foxhound]

The picture of Alanz' son working on his dome is a classic. And the comment we didn't know back then about needing to do a break-in!
Responsible manufacturing at that point would have been to add a kiln drying step. There are plenty of novices who won't be able to closely hold a low temp in the first few uses.

Maybe they should include an instructional video called DIY Tile for the Unlucky Kamado Owner.

It should include a respirator and Dr. Referral for the respiratory problem you will have after working on the portlant cement problem with a grinder.

[curly]

It looks like it may well be mixed with asbestos